Tuesday 23 November Participants * Nicole * Bernard * Sumana * Ernest * Georgia Agenda * status & blockers * Pradyun: can join tomorrow's meeting in its entirety * only 1 blocker, #9011. Not been able to wrap his head around why resolvelib is misbehaving. Stuck. Need to tag and work with TP. * also, would be nice to have if we could do it in time: Mac OS Big Sur changed things, including how Mac OS tags work. That then requires an update in `packaging` + pip. But it's ok to go without. * this will go in 20.3.1 * Bernard: spoke with Sumana about expectations for UX training. Now: continuing with pip research analysis, reports. * would like the mental model review (spreadsheet). Would be really helpful if some people looked at it. * TODO: Pradyun will look today * wants to get training stuff ready, ideally to do work in December. * TODO: Bernard need to pick up again the interviews with people who run package managers * TODO: Sumana to nudge people * Nicole: interviews re doc: done 3-4, have more scheduled this week. Starting to get a picture on what we should do to improve pip's docs. Will be ale to make strong recommendations based on that! * continuing to summarise research finds we have * no blockers right now * Q from Pradyun: has nicole seen the Matomo PR/discussion? https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/8517#issuecomment-730373194 * ? what is blocking it being merged? * consensus * is there a policy on PyPA/PSF stuff? * Ernest: no. We use Google Analytics... respects Do Not Track cookie. If we need a policy, we should contact Legal and start that process * Georgia: we don't want to do something out of line with what PSF is doing * Ernest: comes down to where data is stored. per GDPR, we do not store really anything on any PSF property that is not critical to behavior of service. [This means a lot of GDPR does not apply] Here, user behavior, need to be more careful, since not critical to behavior of pip. * Google Analytics - storing user behavior [more detailed question about storage] * Ernest: for purposes of docs, we have used GA for other similar site properties * Pradyun: would be using the hosted version of matomo.org * Georgia: wondering whether to align with, well, PSF is the org here, so, use the analytics * Ernest: we've had minimal pushback on python.org and pypa.org having GA * Ernest: hosted/free service would be rad * by precedent, GA would not be a problem at all. a free service that is an alternative that PyPA wants to use, that is fine as a reasonable alternative * TODO: Sumana to take a fresh look after call at Matomo discussion * Bernard wanted to ask: what questions are we trying to answer by adding analytics to docs? to minimise extra data being unnecessarily gathered. * Georgia: what sections of docs are being used. * Georgia: it would be a PSF conversation to possibly move over to Matomo from Google Analytics * it can be hard if different sub orgs do different things * discussion of 20.3 release - deferred till tomorrow * discussion of prepping for UX training - deferred till tomorrow